Brazilian President Luiz Inácio Lula da Silva has claimed that former U.S. President Joe Biden spoke to him “at length” about his desire to defeat Russia and his view that Russia must be destroyed.
In an interview with Le Monde published Tuesday, Lula was asked about the ongoing war in Ukraine. While reiterating his opposition to Russia’s 2022 invasion, Lula emphasized that Western nations share partial responsibility for the conflict.
His most striking remarks, however, focused on his conversations with Biden. “Joe Biden, with whom I had long discussions, believed that Russia must be destroyed,” Lula said. “And Europe, which once played the role of a moderating force, is now aligned with Washington and is pouring billions into rearmament.”
Lula added that he did not believe peace could be achieved under such conditions.
Although the Brazilian leader has attempted to mediate the conflict—most notably by visiting Moscow last month in an effort to convince Russian President Vladimir Putin to meet with Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky—his efforts have so far yielded little. Putin declined to meet with Lula, citing scheduling constraints.
Lula’s latest remarks have reignited debate over the extent of Western involvement in the war. Analysts have long questioned whether NATO and EU countries are simply supporting an ally under attack or are, in effect, waging a proxy war against Russia through Ukraine.
Biden’s stance has drawn scrutiny before. Early in the conflict, during a speech in Poland, Biden stated that Russian President Vladimir Putin “cannot remain in power.” The White House later walked back the remark, saying Biden had spoken emotionally and was not calling for regime change in Moscow.
Nevertheless, many of the Biden administration’s actions and subsequent disclosures suggest that Washington's goal was to inflict a strategic defeat on Russia—potentially without fully accounting for Ukraine’s own national interests or long-term needs.